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10:48PM
Aug-12-09
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Grant Barrett
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If a colleague repeatedly mispronounces a word, what's the best way to handle it? Should you correct him? Ignore it? Is it possible to discuss the proper way to say something without being rude or condescending?
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1:47AM
Aug-13-09
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Hansen
| | 中國上海 | |
| Member | posts 19 |
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I'm still wondering why the plural ending "-i" of words such as "illuminati", "literati", which are borrowed likewise directly from latin 2nd declension nouns, are more common to be pronounced as "EE" than "Y". Though /STI-myoo-lee/ may be in fact uncommon, I personally think there is nothing wrong with it…which simply depends on whether its pronunciation is treated as a totally naturalized English word or simply a loan…
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5:25AM
Aug-13-09
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Glenn
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Post edited 10:40AM – Aug-13-09 by Glenn
Post edited 6:02AM – Aug-12-09 by Glenn
This problem can occur whenever a word coming from another language is assimilated without a spelling change.
The pronunciation of stimuli as /stim-yu-lee/ is what we were taught in Latin language class. In English I pronounce it as you all do. Still, I sympathize with those who are drawn astray. Even when pronouncing Latin as Latin, there is often a disagreement between those who adhere to academic Latin and those who espouse church Latin.
I once had a pastor who, in one sermon, kept referring to Zeus as /ZAY-us/. I was confused, and marvelled at the possibility he was referring to Planet of the Apes. It was only on the third or fourth reference that I even realized it was Zeus.
When given the rare opportunity, I would always council a public speaker to err on the side of effective communication. In public speaking, if you need to use an uncommon pronunciation, you should introduce it. I had a great Philosophy prof who introduced Kant by saying “Some say /kahnt/ and some say /kant/. Most academics prefer /kahnt/. I can’t say /kahnt/.”
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6:05AM
Aug-13-09
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Glenn
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Post edited 12:41PM – Aug-13-09 by Glenn
I’m still wondering why the plural ending “-i” of words such as “illuminati”, “literati”, which are borrowed likewise directly from latin 2nd declension nouns, are more common to be pronounced as “EE” than “Y”.
Most words ending in -i in English are pronounced with a final /ee/ sound, regardless of origin. This includes a large number of Latin plurals. The only exceptions are a considerable number of Latin plurals — perhaps the more common ones — and a few strays. Still no insight on why, though. I suspect in some cases it has to do with when the word was assimilated with respect to the Great Vowel Shift in English (roughly 1450-1740), or by analogy to older words.
For example, the “null” case: I
For additional example:
Stimuli, alumni, cacti, fungi, radii (NB /ee/ then /eye/), foci, gemini, gladioli, hippopotami (NB. from Greek), nuclei, etc.
And, of course:
Jedi
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8:13AM
Aug-13-09
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Hansen
| | 中國上海 | |
| Member | posts 19 |
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Post edited 1:26PM – Aug-13-09 by Hanson
Thanks for the examples, Glenn…”Jedi” is a good one ![]()
It is true that there are more examples in when Latin plural “-i” is pronounced in English as /Y/ than those as /EE/. Come to think of it, never have I ever pronounced fungi/’fʌnʒɑɪ/ as /’fʌngɪ/, termini /’tɝmɪnɑɪ/ as /’tɝmɪnɪ/, gemini/’dʒɛmɪnɑɪ/ as /’dʒɛmɪnɪ/, loci/ləʊkɑɪ/ as /ləʊkɪ/,etc.
Though personally I do not frown upon the pronunciation of that /Y/ into /EE/, I totally agree with “to introduce an uncommon pronunciation” in order to eschew the confusion and to reach a mutual understanding.
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