Quantcast
A Way with Words, public radio's lively language call-in show, hosted by Martha Barnette and Grant Barrett.
Listen | Newsletter | Ask a Question | Donate Now | Sponsorship |Discussion Forums
Discussion Forums | Start a New Discussion
 
You must be logged in to post Login Register
Search Forums:


 






Minimum search word length is 4 characters – Maximum search word length is 84 characters
Wildcard Usage:
*  matches any number of characters    %  matches exactly one character

 

A Way with Words is supported by:

 

10 Years in the Making with 10,000 New Words and Senses.   National University: Change your future today.
UserPost

8:04AM
Jan-26-08


Grant Barrett

San Diego, California

Admin

posts 1197

In this episode, a listener says his friend Harold like to do social phoning while driving, so he's invented a term for mindless calling while in the car. And no, it's not “car-pe diem.” Also, Martha and Grant also discuss the rules of the road games “padiddle” and “slug bug.”

Maybe you know it as "perdiddle," but a Wisconsinite shares memories of playing “padiddle.” You need at least two people in a car, an oncoming vehicle with a headlight out, and, depending on which version of the game you play, you need to be prepared for kissing, punching, ceiling-thwacking, beer-buying, or stripping. Grant describes the Volkswagen-inspired of another road-trip game, "slug bug.”

A listener from Falmouth, Maine disagrees with his Canadian friends about how to pronounce the word “aunt.” He says it shouldn't sound like the name of the insect. But is that the way most people pronounce this word for your mother's sister?

A Hoosier says her friends tease her about the way she says “doofitty” when she can't think of the right word for something. Grant and Martha discuss the long list of linguistic placeholders, including “whatchamacallit,” “doodad,” “deely-bobber,” “doowanger,” “doojigger,” “doohickey,” “thingamabob,” “thingummy,” “thingum,” and “thingy.”

A California man remembers going to the neighborhood bakery back home in Illinois and ordering “bismarcks.” But these days he rarely hears this term for “jelly doughnut,” and wonders about its origin.

This week's Slang This! contestant guesses at the meaning of the slang expressions “wigs on the green” and “fake and bake.”

Grant and Martha read emails from listeners with suggested explanations as to how the term “biffy” came to mean “portable toilet.”

They also discuss listener's own stories about saying “bread and butter” when companions step around an obstacle that divides them. Popeye does that little “bread and butter” step about 5:47 into .

We also promised words for the experience of noticing a word for the first time and then feeling like you're seeing it everywhere. Here are a few: .

A retired professor wants to know if Latin grammar holds any clues about whether a female professor is properly addressed as “professor emeritus” or “professor emerita.”

Finally, a woman who grew up playing “Duck, Duck, Goose” is surprised to hear that her niece and nephew play “Duck, Duck, Gray Duck” at their preschool in Minnesota. The hosts take a gander at regional variations of this children's game.

And with that, we're ducking out of here until next week.


Read the original blog post.

3:30PM
Jan-26-08


Del Amsel

Guest

Grant Barrett said:
In this episode, a listener says his friend Harold like to do social phoning while driving, so he's invented a term for mindless calling while in the car. And no, it's not “car-pe diem.”

Here are some more suggestions:
triplipflipping (my favorite, but it wouldn't catch on),
motormouthing, roadphoning, car-yakking, jawriding,
DWJ ("driving while jabbering").

And here are two more, with apologies to Tom and Ray:
cartalking (talking while driving)
click-clacking (texting while driving)

5:00PM
Jan-26-08


Tracy

Member

posts 4

Regarding "bismarcks": After listening to the show today, in which a listener was describing the jelly doughnuts known as bismarcks, I was in the kitchen and happened to be using my Pampered Chef Easy Accent Decorator. The decorator includes a Bismarck Tip, with instructions: "Use to easily fill bismarcks and eclairs". There is an illustration of a pastry being filled. Looks a lot like a jelly doughnut! Interesting coincidence that I came across this on the day your listener called in with his word, and I will also note that Pampered Chef headquarters are in Addison, Illinois!

8:01AM
Jan-27-08


Steve N.

Guest

RE: Bismarck
I'm surprised that neither of you noticed the problem that jelly doughnuts have no holes (at least, around here, they don't) and therefore aren't doughnuts !

Regards, with knowledge of bismarcks in Illinois, Steve

8:06AM
Jan-27-08


Grant Barrett

San Diego, California

Admin

posts 1197

Steve, who says doughnuts have to have holes? No dictionary defines them as having to have holes although they all mention that they can have holes.

9:04AM
Jan-27-08


R McElroy

Guest

On the Bismark tip, it comes up during this audio clip, which investigates another sweet roll mystery the "Persian":

I grew up in central Wisconsin in the 60's and recall my mother (of German heritage) calling an icing and chopped nut covered roll a "Persian".

She also called what is commonly known as a "Long John" a "Chicago". I wonder if "Chicago" is tied somehow to Chicago politician "Long" John Wentworth — who had some interesting dining habits.

It is amazing how difficult it is to find a solid source for this bakery related info on the web. The loss of many small independant bakeries ("Hostessification") probably plays a large "roll".

11:02AM
Jan-27-08


R McElroy

Guest

"Cell-suckling" Harold is all over the road.

3:18PM
Jan-27-08


Tracy

Member

posts 4

I vote that doughnuts do not need to have holes to be called a doughnut (or a donut!). Do(ugh)nut holes are pretty popular with my kids, though – as in Entemann's "Pop'ems". Glazed is preferred.

7:38PM
Jan-27-08


martha

martha

Admin

posts 817

Del Amsel, I think I'm now partial to "jawriding." Very nice! Thanks for that.

7:24AM
Jan-28-08


Steve N.

Guest

Grant Barrett said:

Steve, who says doughnuts have to have holes?[snip]


Grant,
Well… Perhaps this is a regional thing, but I think it's those guys who stand out in street intersections, around here, once a year passing out cardboard do(ugh)nuts [*with holes*] on do(ugh)nut day. You don't see any of them without holes, do ya?
Also, there's the Salvation Army, or was it the Red Cross who started the whole thing during WWI or was it WWII.
Then there's the standard "the dictionary does not determine what is and is not correct; it is a reflection of usage" argument.
And then… And then… Why do(ugh)"nut" instead of do(ugh)"ring", or do(ugh)torus, or something [ for the ones *with* holes, whatever you call them].
Besides, with the human propensity to name EVERYTHING [not to mention the whole (sic) purpose of your radio program], there absolutely has to be a name to differentiate between holed and holeless, no?
And, although we're not supposed to begin a sentence with 'and' or 'but', since we have Bismarck, long John, Persian, Danish, Sweet Roll, and and a host, or is it hostest, of others, the holed seem to need (sic) a distinguished name of their own.
So, I'm thinkin' do(gh)nut is j u s t right.

Regards, from the heartland, Steve
(;-)

P.S. I just remembered. I don't recall hearing if anyone mentioned the self-contradicting twist "Away With Words"

10:09AM
Jan-28-08


martha

martha

Admin

posts 817

And Steve: Not to mention that when you order a bunch of doughnut holes, they're not holes at all, right?

And while we're at it: How many times does one get to say in everyday conversation? Thanks for the opportunity!

10:12AM
Jan-28-08


Grant Barrett

San Diego, California

Admin

posts 1197

I don't recall hearing if anyone mentioned the self-contradicting twist “Away With Words”

Oh, yes, the redivision joke about the name of the show is an oldie. The one I haven't seen is to redivide it as "Aw, Ay, With Words."

2:49PM
Jan-28-08


Felix the Black Cat

Guest

Regarding the discussion of the word "aunt," I've ALWAYS heard it with the 'u' actually pronounced, at least in actual face-to-face conversation in MN & WI, and not as a homophone of the name for the hill-building insect. I'm frankly flabbergasted to hear that the silent-'u' pronunciation is considered "standard." At what point do enough people get something wrong to make it "right"? Is truth up for a majority vote now? Why isn't the word "ain't" considered to be standard, then? Why is "aunt" still spelled with a 'u'? We use "aluminum" in America instead of the British spelling "aluminium," since we don't pronounce that final 'i' anymore. So, why is that 'u' ignored so often, or why is it still there if we're not going to pronounce it? It seems to me that we should either pronounce it, or get rid of it altogether.

Or am I just an old math major who is constantly being driven crazy by all the illogical inconsistencies of language?

3:53PM
Jan-28-08


Dr. Brian Bartel

Guest

Dear Martha and Grant,
As a former resident of Windom, Minnesota, I'd like to share with you that as a small child, the use of "gray duck" was usually used as a fake in a game of duck-duck-goose. You'd walk around the circle, calling out duck, duck, duck, and then g-g-g-g-gray duck, to make the other kids think that you were about to say g-g-g-g-g-goose. The "guh" sound was meant to rile the other kids, so they didn't know what to expect.
Also, on the Bismarck/jelly doughnut discussion, we had another term for that item in Minnesota- a Bavarian Creme. I always associated a Bismarck and/or Bavarian Creme as being filled with custard creme, as opposed to jelly doughnuts, which contained jelly. Scandanavians know their dessert pastries. I was really disappointed recently when a ordered a Bismarck near my in-laws house on the Long Beach Peninsula of Washington, and it was filled with Jello pudding- bleh!

Thanks for the great podcast,
Brian Bartel

4:53PM
Jan-28-08


martha

martha

Admin

posts 817

Felix, I'm an old English major and those logical inconsistences drive me crazy as well! (And mind you, that's not an Old English major, although I did enjoy the year of it I had in college.)

And you're right that over time, standards change. We're just not there yet with "awnt" in Standard English, although as we mentioned on the air, it's certainly standard in some dialects.

5:11PM
Jan-28-08


martha

martha

Admin

posts 817

Brian, thanks for this addition to the duck-duck discussion. I'd not heard that one, and I have a feeling we may revisit this question on the air, so maybe we'll mention it as well.

(And PLEASE tell me you're kidding about the Jell-O doughnut!)

6:00PM
Jan-28-08


Colin

Guest

I thought of a word for calling to chat while driving. Commuticating (commute+communicate) seems to blend well and denote the meaning.

7:05PM
Jan-28-08


Tom Haglund

Guest

Dear Way:

Subj: Technology driven neologism.

Heard the bit Saturday about the need for a word to describe celyakking while driving.

How about another term for just plain inappropriate celyakking behavior: when someone feels compelled to invade the personal sound space of others in order to spew celludrivel into an electronic ego extension device, this could be called cellurudeness.

Then there is the inane practice of filling one's moments of solitude with trivial yak to avoid any feeling of actually being; cellutherapy might do.

Back to the point; driving while in any way distracted is highly risky behavior, one might call it cellurisky if it involves the cell phone.

I suggest that celyakking, cellurude, cellurisk, celludrivel, and cellutherapy might be useful additions to our gargantuan and ever-growing language. After all, we are comfortable with gozinta and blog, are we not?

Tom Haglund
Loreto, BCS, Mexico

7:52PM
Jan-28-08


Tracy

Member

posts 4

In reply to Brian; your note about creme-filled doughnuts brought back memories. We called them Bavarian Cremes back in Michigan as well:^)

1:39PM
Jan-29-08


Linda

Guest

On the topic of padiddles, the name of that other game isn't Slug Bug, it's Punch Buggy, at least in my car. Now, for a reverse padiddle, I've taken to using padassle, but not in front of my mother.

Oh. and another thing while I'm here…

My father had and Aunt Nancy who was from the mid-west. She married a California man and they ended up in Connecticut. She was very particular that her title sounded like the insect, not that strange local pronunciation the other folks nearby seemed to prefer. Besides, Ant Nancy has a much better rhyme to it.

5:22PM
Jan-29-08


dilettante

Member

posts 265

Regarding speculation that "biffy" originated from the initials of the company "BFI," or Browning-Ferris Industries:

Not likely. According to "," BFI didn't exist before 1969.

(You find all sorts of interesting tidbits on the 'net.)

10:53AM
Feb-01-08


Ian

Guest

Wow, we have a lot in common! My dad also had an Aunt Nancy. I agree, sounds good. The game is Punch Buggy in my background too, with a twist: you had to say the color of the Bug you saw, and there was often a "no punchbacks" to preclude retaliation. So "punchbuggyblacknopunchbacks!" without taking a breath is how it would sound.

Also I only knew the strip version of padiddle. You'd only play with a mixed gender group in the car. Whoever called padiddle caused everyone of the opposite gender removed an item. Racy!

Linda said:

On the topic of padiddles, the name of that other game isn't Slug Bug, it's Punch Buggy, at least in my car. Now, for a reverse padiddle, I've taken to using padassle, but not in front of my mother.

Oh. and another thing while I'm here…

My father had and Aunt Nancy who was from the mid-west. She married a California man and they ended up in Connecticut. She was very particular that her title sounded like the insect, not that strange local pronunciation the other folks nearby seemed to prefer. Besides, Ant Nancy has a much better rhyme to it.


11:01AM
Feb-01-08


Lychee

Salem, Ma.

Member

posts 8

Regarding finding a word for people who talk (or text) on their phones while driving, I believe there already are words for them; stupid, dangerous and (in at least two states) illegal are just three of them.

"If you can't be kind, at least have the decency to be vague"

6:02AM
Feb-02-08


Glenn Atkinson

Guest

I grew up in Philadelphia. I remember playing the "pidoodle" (although some said padiddle) game in the car. We also had a corresponding term for a burnt out taillight — "dinklepink." As I recall, the rules for the dinklepink would vary depending upon local agreement. Sometimes it even counted the same — although it must always be declared with the proper term, or the claim would be null and void.

6:07AM
Feb-02-08


Glenn Atkinson

Guest

Growing up in Philadelphia, I never encountered a Bismarck until I went to school in New Hampshire. There, a Bismarck was not really a jelly doughnut, but an entirely new pastry. It was more like a cross between a jelly doughnut and an eclair. It was a long thin pastry, cut lengthwise and filled with pastry creme (never custard) and layered with jelly. As I recall, a sprinkling of powdered sugar was always on top. It was delightful, and worthy of an elevated name.

8:42AM
Feb-02-08


Ann B.

Guest

I grew up in Grand Island, NE, and we always played "Duck, Duck, Gray Duck." When I moved to North Carolina, my young daughters came home from school and talked about playing "Duck, Duck, Goose." I was really puzzled and thought they were pulling my leg. I guess Duck, Duck Gray Duck reaches beyond Minnesota!

I would have played this game in the late 50's or early 60's. My daughters played in the 80's.

Also, those of us native to Nebraska pronounce "Aunt" as "ant".

I'm a new listener to your podcast. I love it!

9:22AM
Feb-02-08


Monica Sandor

Guest

My father had and Aunt Nancy who was from the mid-west. She married a California man and they ended up in Connecticut. She was very particular that her title sounded like the insect, not that strange local pronunciation the other folks nearby seemed to prefer. Besides, Ant Nancy has a much better rhyme to it.




In my experience, awnt is the pronunciation in most of Britain and also, oddly, in the Maritime provinces of Canada (perhaps not everywhere but certainly in New Brunswick that is how I heard it) but not anywhere else in Canada that I know of.

I think it is not unusual for there to be different pronunciations in Britain and in North America even where the spelling is the same (including, for instance, putting the stress on different syllables as in the word 'CONtroversy' vs 'conTROVersy').

9:51AM
Feb-02-08


martha

martha

Admin

posts 817

Welcome, Ann B., and thanks for this information. Trust me, Grant and I get a huge kick out of collecting all these examples!

And Monica, yes, I like the sound of "Ant Nancy" much better myself.

12:51PM
Feb-02-08


jedwardcooper

Member

posts 22

Ian said:

Wow, we have a lot in common! My dad also had an Aunt Nancy. I agree, sounds good. The game is Punch Buggy in my background too, with a twist: you had to say the color of the Bug you saw, and there was often a “no punchbacks” to preclude retaliation. So “punchbuggyblacknopunchbacks!” without taking a breath is how it would sound.

Okay, so I have an Aunt Nancy and I am with you on the rhyme. I hail from Maryland—in the PA/DE corner (closer to Wilmington and Philadelphia than anywhere in MD really)—and it's definitely Punch Buggy how you described–punchbuggyred!

5:02AM
Feb-03-08


Jazyk

Member

posts 21

If anybody is interested in how it works in Latin, professor is a word that had no feminine form, and since emeritus, past participle of the verb emereo, translations , needs to agree with the noun its modifies (as all adjectives do), the only possible form, at least in Latin, would be professor emeritus. Professor emerita wouldn't be correct because there's lack of agreement. If the Romans had created professora (which does exist in Romance languages like Portuguese and Spanish, in the latter with one s: profesora), it would have been professora emerita.

4:00PM
Feb-03-08


Katie

Guest

We were an equal-opportunity punchbuggy/slugbug family. As long as you got the punch in first, it didn't matter. We also called out the color.

In regard to Martha's question about perdiddles and the version for a tail light out–we used to call it "perdunkle."

Linda said:

On the topic of padiddles, the name of that other game isn't Slug Bug, it's Punch Buggy, at least in my car. Now, for a reverse padiddle, I've taken to using padassle, but not in front of my mother.


5:08PM
Feb-03-08


Bob

Guest

I think you guys missed the point from the caller in Indiana who asked about doofitty. She was speaking about a situation where you can't remember a person's name. All of the words you came up with refer to things refer to things you cannot remember the na,ke for, at least that's the way I heard it. I wantedto add that I've been using the word doofus (sic?) as long as I can remember when I can't recall a person's name. I have also heard people referred to as a doofus, which isn't very flattering.

I Love the podcast. My wife and I came across you guys on Wisconsin Public Radio while on a camping trip to Lake Superior about a year and a half ago. We don't get the show on Illinois Public Radio so I subscribe to the podcast.

Bob Vincent
Springfield, IL

8:49AM
Feb-05-08


AnnMarie

Guest

Minnesota is NOT the only place that plays duck, duck, grey duck. I grew up in South Dakota and we played it, too! I grew up in Madison, which, to be honest, isn't too far from Minnesota, but my friends throughout the state also played grey duck. I went to college of MN and this was a perennial conversation with folks from around the US. We never noticed a MN connection back then so I suspect others will be reporting that they, too, played it outside of MN.

My group of friends (don't know if it was my neighborhood or the school I went to later on, not the same group of people), revised the game. We played "pink duck, blue duck, black duck, orange duck" etc., so that you really had to be paying attention to notice "grey duck"! I think I may have come up with the idea, but can't be certain.

I was also familiar with duck, duck, goose, so we may have played both versions in Madison and elsewhere in South Dakota, or it may have been because of my relatives in other states.

1:54PM
Feb-07-08


Monika

Guest

Incidentally, the only dish that Bismarck is associated with in Germany is marinated herring, see e.g.

Couldn't be further removed from doughnuts, could it?

8:31AM
Feb-19-08


Faux Frenchie

Guest

When I was a teen in Utah we played both "Perdiddle" and "Slug Bug," and the tail light version–quite similar to Katie's–was "Perdunk."

Katie said:

We were an equal-opportunity punchbuggy/slugbug family. As long as you got the punch in first, it didn't matter. We also called out the color.


In regard to Martha's question about perdiddles and the version for a tail light out–we used to call it “perdunkle.”