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9:47PM
Jul-22-10
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Radioso
| | Arcata CA | |
| Member | posts 4 | |
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It seems that the local plural possessive term for a thing owned by us and referred to by them is "Your guys' (pron: your guyses). Example:
"I like this car! Is it your guys'?"
Is this happening everywhere?
-BT
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9:56PM
Jul-22-10
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Radioso
| | Arcata CA | |
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Post edited 10:09PM – Jul-22-10 by Radioso
OK, I'm a newbie and I don't know if my post went up, or in any direction. So I'll ask a more important question in reply and see if anyone sees it.
Why do we now have an extra "is" in phrases like "the thing is.." or "The fact of the matter is…"?
These words used to be followed by the thing the speaker believed to be true, but recently the speaker has added an extra "is". "The thing is, is that…" or "The fact of the matter IS, is etc)". What IS it with this idiot IS?
E.B. White wrote about "the idiot "please". What can we do about the idiot "is"?
Barry Thorpe
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12:39AM
Jul-23-10
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Ron Draney
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Are you sure that the "idiot 'is'" isn't something else? While I'm sure some people use it the way you describe, it usually turns out that the actual sentence is something like "What the fact of the matter is is that kittens are adorable". The first of those two "is"s is part of the subordinate clause functioning as the subject of the overall sentence; turn it around to get "That kittens are adorable is what the fact of the matter is" and it may be clearer that it's not just a kind of stutter.
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3:31AM
Jul-23-10
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Glenn
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Post edited 9:07AM – Jul-23-10 by Glenn
The question is "Is 'is' being doubled ungrammatically?" What my opinion is is that radioso's observation and concern are on target. Many people have made the same observation and share the concern or, at least, interest. There are academic studies of this growing pattern. Some of the terms used to describe it are "isis," "double be," "extris" (extra is, of which isis is a subtype), "reduplicative copula," and "double copula" (copula doubling, doubled copula, etc., not to be confused with a "double cupola" — see image below). Now we can add, albeit subjectively, "the idiot is."
It is not that the listeners are missing the "what" that is spoken. And it is not merely a stammering repetition of the copula (see the second link below "ISIS …"). It occurs in writing often enough to prove it is not a speech or hearing problem. The doubling often comes before that and is not always the same form of the verb to be.
"The problem is is that …"
"The question is is that … "
"The best thing was is that …"
"My favorite part is is that …"
Etc.
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11:28PM
Aug-21-10
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Bob Bridges
| | USA | |
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Ron, you're right that "is" can be doubled correctly, but Radioso is right too; more and more commonly, people are saying "The thing is is that I just hate it when…". I first noticed it a few decades ago and it's been growing more frequent. My own theory is that it started with people saying "The thing is….[pause for thought] …is that I just hate it when…". But it's grown far beyond that initial reasonable explanation; they're everywhere, they're everywhere!
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10:39AM
Aug-22-10
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torpeau
| | Left coast of FL | |
| Member | posts 75 | |
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Radioso said:
It seems that the local plural possessive term for a thing owned by us and referred to by them is "Your guys' (pron: your guyses). Example:
"I like this car! Is it your guys'?"
Is this happening everywhere?
-BT
I have heard "your guys'" before. Waitresses frequently call male/female couples "guys" nowadays.
BTW, I would not add an "es" to the pronunciation of "guys'."
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12:05PM
Aug-22-10
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Bob Bridges
| | USA | |
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I know some think of "guys" as exclusively male, and obviously in the phrase "guys and gals" it is. But it's handy for an informal form of address, so I say "you guys" to a mixed audience about half the time, myself.
Not sure what the possessive form would be, though; I'd never, ever say "your guys", which after all means "the guys pertaining to you". I'd probably work around it, saying "I like this car; does it belong to you guys?", or, more likely, "…Does it belong to y'all?". But then, if I use "y'all" I can equally well ask "…Is it y'all's?".
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