Interesting. Boxer is my senator, and I wonder if there is any official protocol or guidelines for how people are supposed to address each other in DC. But then again, Boxer asks the General to "do her a favor," and admits that it's "just a thing." So, even if it's not official protocol, Boxer is expressing a personal preference, and I suppose that is her prerogative. It would have been funny if the General had, in turn, asked Boxer to address him as Brigadier General. But I guess that he didn't just have a thing about his title. Or maybe he didn't work as hard as Boxer did to get his title.

I'm currently a little peeved at Boxer about a recent email she sent me (as one of her constituents, I get monthly updates from Boxer's office). As many of you know, California is in a bit of a financial pickle. Senator Boxer informed me that she is working hard on this:

I recently honored baseball great Rickey Henderson’s upcoming induction into the Hall of Fame with a statement that appeared in the Congressional Record. You can find my statement below, and I am pleased to share it with you.

Barbara Boxer
United States Senator

The email contains the entire, long-winded statement, and I won't bother pasting it here. Somehow this doesn't seem so senatorial.

I'm not sure there is anything "improper" about addressing a female senator as ma'am, unless there is something improper about addressing a male senator as sir. But if the same general addressed the male senators as senator, and Boxer as ma'am, then that is an entirely different matter. But something would be seriously wrong with the "liberal biased media" if that part of the story was left out.

Watching the video makes it clear enough that Boxer was making a polite request, though she seemed a bit flustered, calling it "just a thing" and saying how hard she worked to get the title. If the male senators were addressed as Senator while Boxer was addressed as Ma'am, then I wonder why Boxer would apologize for her request.

Butting in is what it's all about on a discussion board, and you can tell all your gal friends that drinks are free for all ladies in this forum – we want more of you.

No, I've never been a lady in a man's world, but I've done my fair share of groveling and kowtowing to men and women! Adult life is not so much different than 5-year-olds playing and fighting in a sandbox, after all.

Back to Boxer, can anybody verify that the General was addressing the male senators in that meeting as senator while addressing Boxer as ma'am? I understand the point you're making, mclarevds, but I'm not sure that Boxer is the kind of person who shys away from a justifiable demand or scolding.

Post edited 9:02PM – Jul-09-09 by Glenn

I remember as a new reader of this board, it was not at first clear to me in similar contexts that you were quoting. I’m not sure why. Once I realized you were, I felt that I shouldn’t have missed that fact. But I did.

Post edited 6:44PM – Jul-10-09 by Glenn

(By the way, what’s the difference between an extract and an excerpt?)

Oo, oo! An extract is a tract that was taken out of something else, whereas an excerpt is something that used to be a cerpt.

une voie avec les mots, n’est-ce pas?

This fractured French took me way to long to figure out. I love it. (You can “frapper la rue, Jacques,” if you disagree.) Have you ever studied Japanese?

I wish that Grant would give us his two cents, so I can have the opportunity to take him to task …

I believe I have also expressed how much fun it is disagree with MR. Barrett. (Also no PhD here, but I like to practice the attitude, in case.)

Grant said:
Boxer scolds Army General for not calling her “Senator”. «… demands the title “Senator”. So much so that she interrupted his testimony to scold him for the apparent lack of respect.»

I understand the <> is a quote but the first 'scolds' wasn't yours?

I have found 2 claims that the male Senators were being addressed as such, one at a left-leaning site and another in a post far down on the site linked to. I have been unable to find any news, only discussions.

Mary Clare, Vista CA

It's always sooo much more fun when Grant is wrong. Doesn't everyone just love to argue with him? I spend most of my time listening and reading the discussions trying to work out exactly how Grant is wrong, and constructing the polemic. In this case Grant was clearly in the wrong for quoting the article and failing to add his own words for us to attack. Really, Grant, you must be more careful in the future.

The general did address the male senators as "sir," and other female senators as "ma'am." Repeatedly. Boxer was the only senator present (in almost an hour of testimony — it's pretty tedious,) who insisted on the use of the title "senator" from General Walsh.
Here's the webcast of the hearing:

http://epw.senate.gov/public/i…..8ed0b6d074

I've watched the first hour, and I've seen enough to have an informed opinion. In a nutshell, I don't have a problem with what Boxer said to the General. Within context, it even made some sense.

The General was the first witness in the hearing. He's the guy in charge of the Army Engineer Corps on the project to build hurricane defenses in New Orleans. Senator Boxer is the Chair of the Senate committee that oversees that project (Committee on Environment and Public Works). There have been a lot of frustrating delays in this project. This hearing was an effort to get things going in the right direction, and it is my opinion that the General was less forthcoming than he should have been. But, back to the point of this discussion.

The General was addressed throughout as General, by everyone, including Boxer. Indeed, as the General was introduced, Boxer made a point of his title. The other two senators present in the meeting, Vitter and Landrieu, addressed Boxer as "Madam Chair." At first, the General addressed Boxer as Madam Chair as well. As things got more "conversational" in the question and answer phase, he lapsed into "ma'am." In general, so to speak, the General was under fire, not just from Boxer but from Vitter and Landrieu. He was a frustratingly difficult witness. When questioned by Vitter, General Walsh would sometimes say "Senator" and sometimes "Sir." When questioned by Landrieu, he mostly used "Ma'am." Neither Vitter nor Landrieu said anything about it; I think they were focusing on the General's caginess. But, I do not fault Boxer for doing so. If the General can enjoy his title when conducting official business, then he should acquire the habit of addressing others by their titles. In this setting I don't think that Sir and Ma'am were the proper forms of address, no matter what military protocol allows in certain circumstances.

I would like to say something else. Watching Boxer, Vitter, and Landrieu in action, I was impressed. They were prepared and properly concerned about the matter at hand, and they were models of clear communication. I see that it's all too easy to get caught up in the gossipy side of news, for example, about Vitter's involvement with prostitutes. And it's all too easy to imagine that the country is being run by a bunch of incompetents who are liars and hypocrites. But maybe liars and hypocrites are not necessarily incompetent, and maybe some of them do more good than harm?